Gaslight digest of discussion from 97-apr-16 to 97-apr-17



----------------------------THE HEADERS---------------------------

Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 03:30:12 -0700
From: Jack Kolb 
Subject: Re: graverobber story [11234] [11236] [11247] [11249] [11250]

Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 13:56:59 +0000 (UT)
From: Jo Ann Citron 
Subject: body snatching [11251]

Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 09:44:10 -0500
From: "S.T. Karnick" 
Subject: Re: "The Purple Emperor" [11217] [11252]

Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 13:05:23 -0700 (MST)
From: "STEPHEN DAVIES, MT. ROYAL COLLEGE" 
Subject: Etext avail: Ingoldsby's "The spectre of Tappington" [11253]

Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 13:50:58 -0700
From: Jack Kolb 
Subject: Re: body snatching [11251] [11254]

Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 14:54:57 -0700 (MST)
From: "STEPHEN DAVIES, MT. ROYAL COLLEGE" 
Subject: Naive question about Gypsies [11255]

Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 15:17:40 -0700 (MST)
From: "STEPHEN DAVIES, MT. ROYAL COLLEGE" 
Subject: Robert Chambers page [11256]

Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 14:24:21 -0700
From: Jeff Sargent 
Subject: Re: Naive question about Gypsies [11255] [11257]

Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 17:30:33 -0500 (EST)
From: Robert Champ 
Subject: re: Naive question about Gypsies [11255] [11258]

Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 15:42:04 -0600 (MDT)
From: "p.h.wood" 
Subject: Re: Naive question about Gypsies [11255] [11259]

Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 16:48:05 -0500
From: ayc(at)ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (athan y chilton)
Subject: Re: Naive question about Gypsies [11255] [11260]

Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 18:25:04 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jo Churcher 
Subject: Re: Naive question about Gypsies [11255] [11261]

Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 15:50:37 -0700
From: Christopher Roden 
Subject: re: Naive question about Gypsies [11255] [11258] [11262]

Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 16:58:26 -0700 (PDT)
From: Alan Gullette 
Subject: Sam Moskowitz, R.I.P. [11263]

Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 20:23:44 -0400 (EDT)
From: Kujen(at)aol.com
Subject: from the Victorian list [11264]

Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 22:15:03 -0500 (EST)
From: Robert Champ 
Subject: Red Admiral [11265]

Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 21:38:00 -0700
From: Sherlene 
Subject: Re: Red Admiral [11265] [11266]

Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 00:44:03 -0400 (EDT)
From: Debah(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: Chieftans and Gypsies [11267]

Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 23:14:05 -1100
From: jamunro(at)terranet.ab.ca (alan munro)
Subject: Re: graverobber story [11234] [11268]

Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 07:01:51 -0700 (MST)
Date-warning: Date header was inserted by MtRoyal.AB.CA
From: Moudry 
Subject: Re: Sam Moskowitz, R.I.P. [11263] [11269]

Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 08:42:29 -0500
From: ayc(at)ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (athan y chilton)
Subject: re: Naive question about Gypsies [11255] [11258] [11270]

Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 09:37:56 +0000
From: azalcman(at)randomhouse.com
Subject: re: Naive question about Gypsies [11255] [11258] [11271]

Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 09:13:29 -0500
From: ayc(at)ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (athan y chilton)
Subject: re: Naive question about Gypsies [11272]

Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 13:28:49 -0400
From: "John D. Squires" 
Subject: Sam Moskowitz, R. I. P. [11273]

Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 13:28:49 -0400
From: "John D. Squires" 
Subject: Sam Moskowitz, R. I. P. [11274]

Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 17:33:24 -0600 (CST)
From: "Ruth W. Jeffries" 
Subject: Re: Naive question about Gypsies [11255] [11260] [11275]


-----------------------------THE POSTS-----------------------------


Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 03:30:12 -0700
From: Jack Kolb 
Subject: Re: graverobber story [11234] [11236] [11247] [11249] [11250]



Thanks, Stephen, as usual.  Stevenson's story seems the source, but I have
certainly seen film versions with the plot I suggest.  Cheers, Jack
(kolb(at)ucla.edu).


>        Jack K.,
>                Stevenson's "The body-snatcher" is part of the
>        Gaslight fiction webpage, it having been HTMLized for
>        us by Richard King.
>
>                I think the scenario you first proposed is a
>        mix of graverobbing stories, unless you are thinking
>        of the scene where Fettes, as the doctor's asst.,
>        receives the body of a woman he had just seen the
>        previous night, alive and healthy.  I do not remember
>        if we are meaned to infer that she was a girlfriend.
>
>                                 Stephen D
>                                 SDavies(at)mtroyal.ab.ca
>
>        www.mtroyal.ab.ca/programs/arts/english/gaslight
>
>

===0===


Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 13:56:59 +0000 (UT)
From: Jo Ann Citron 
Subject: body snatching [11251]



I have only just come to this list and apologize if this is repetitive.  
Though it hardly answers Jack's question, I highly recommend Simon Schama's 
"Death of a Harvard Man," which originally appeared in Granta 34 and then was 
published in book form with another short piece. An excerpt follows:


"Well, I have done some bad things in my time . . . I never liked it, having 
to sell cadavers to the students for dissection at twenty-five dollars a body, 
but how was I and Caroline and the children to live on the pittance the 
College paid me otherwise?  In the taverns they called me a Resurrection Man 
and said that I had dug fresh graves on the Common and on Copps Hill to supply 
the students, but it was all stories, mostly; only I didn't ask questions of 
those who gave me the bodies.  These days, with all them dying of the cholera 
and in a filthy state, there was a premium on a clean fresh corpse so I was 
doing everyone a good service wasn't I, being the middleman?  The one time I 
had gone out in the night to do it myself I gagged from the badness of it and 
the smell of mushrooms from the earth, and threw up into the grave and swore 
off ever doing it again."
_
_______________________
Jo Ann Citron
jacitron(at)msn.com

===0===


Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 09:44:10 -0500
From: "S.T. Karnick" 
Subject: Re: "The Purple Emperor" [11217] [11252]



Dr. Champ's insights regarding "The Purple Emperor" are fine as always. 
Just a couple of additional observations.

It's to be expected that a story in which two of the main characters are
named after insects will display countless examples of humans acting like
animals (or worse).  Dr. Champ's observations of Darrel's mixed motives in
solving the case is a good example, as is, of course, the cutthroat
competition between the Purple Emperor and Red Admiral for supremacy in
butterfly collecting in their little hamlet.  The absurd intensity of their
trivial pursuit approaches "Rape of the Lock" levels and is quite
effectively satirical without being overdone.

Terrec's animalistic vulgarity is another effective element, as are
numerous phrases such as the following:  "the blacik-and-blue marks . . .
on her soft, round arm," "the look of fear . . . [in] her eyes," "he openly
menaced the Purple Emperor," "I caught him by the throat before he could
fire," "I thought he was going to attack me; but he was merely viciously
drunk," "a nauseating lake of blood on the stone floor, in the center of
which lay a human hand," "the mayor grunted . . . grunted again," and "[the
Purple Emperor ends as] a foaming, howling lunatic." There is a large
amount of physical fighting as well.

Also effective is the use of lures.  A prominent one is the use of insects
to capture fish, which comprises the beginning, middle, and end of the
story and in fact is the background for the Darrel's romance with Lys. 
Darrel uses various false flies to attract an trout, whereas Lys captures
his heart without doing anything at all, and Darrel uses cythyl to lure an
insect (Purple Emperor) to expose a crime just as the Purple Emperor
(human, just barely) used it to lure the original specimen that starts the
story.  And of course the cythyl still on the corpse lures the butterfly
which itself lures Darrel, Durand, and Fortin to the hollow bed beneath the
hearthstone where the body lays buried.  In addition, the handkerchief
lures the police to suspect Darrel of the murder (although, as Dr. Champ
points out, there never seems much likelihood that he'll be convicted; a
small deficiency in an otherwise impressive story).

It is also notable how many escape attempts are in the story.  There are
Darrel, Terrec, and the Purple Emperor, of course, attempting to escape
conviction for murder; the trout trying to escape from Darrel; the
butterfly escaping from its chrysalis and then back into the cafe after
being gently tossed out the door; the Red Admiral's attempts to escape
being murdered by his own son; Lys's escape from the "awful fight" at the
Groix Inn; the Red Admiral's attempt to escape detection while he
researches the use of cythyl and obtains a small supply ("he shut himself
up three weeks ago"); and Lys's attempt to escape the cruelty of her uncle
and the attentions of Terrec.

Chambers achieves all this while maintaining a fairly light tone, which I
think was a good idea considering the underlying nastiness of so much of
the story.  The vision of humanity we derive from this pleasant, bucolic
Breton village is not a pretty one, but the elements of humor and hope,
especially in the romance between Darrel and Lys, balance it effectively
and express a guarded but distinct optimism.

Best w's,

S.T. Karnick

===0===


Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 13:05:23 -0700 (MST)
From: "STEPHEN DAVIES, MT. ROYAL COLLEGE" 
Subject: Etext avail: Ingoldsby's "The spectre of Tappington" [11253]



                         SPCTRTAP.SHT
         Ingoldsby's "The spectre of Tappington" is now available
         as ASCII and on the website.  The ASCII needs the emphasis
         added to certain phrases, and I would like to add the 
         illustrations to the Website.

         Send to: mailserv(at)mtroyal.ab.ca

         the following command:

send [gaslight]spctrtap.sht

         or visit www.mtroyal.ab.ca/programs/arts/english/gaslight

                                          Stephen D
                                          SDavies(at)mtroyal.ab.ca

===0===


Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 13:50:58 -0700
From: Jack Kolb 
Subject: Re: body snatching [11251] [11254]



Many thanks, Jo Ann: wonderful.  Jack (kolb(at)ulca.edu).


>I have only just come to this list and apologize if this is repetitive.  
>Though it hardly answers Jack's question, I highly recommend Simon Schama's 
>"Death of a Harvard Man," which originally appeared in Granta 34 and then was 
>published in book form with another short piece. An excerpt follows:
>
>
>"Well, I have done some bad things in my time . . . I never liked it, having 
>to sell cadavers to the students for dissection at twenty-five dollars a body, 
>but how was I and Caroline and the children to live on the pittance the 
>College paid me otherwise?  In the taverns they called me a Resurrection Man 
>and said that I had dug fresh graves on the Common and on Copps Hill to supply 
>the students, but it was all stories, mostly; only I didn't ask questions of 
>those who gave me the bodies.  These days, with all them dying of the cholera 
>and in a filthy state, there was a premium on a clean fresh corpse so I was 
>doing everyone a good service wasn't I, being the middleman?  The one time I 
>had gone out in the night to do it myself I gagged from the badness of it and 
>the smell of mushrooms from the earth, and threw up into the grave and swore 
>off ever doing it again."
>_
>_______________________
>Jo Ann Citron
>jacitron(at)msn.com
>
>

===0===


Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 14:54:57 -0700 (MST)
From: "STEPHEN DAVIES, MT. ROYAL COLLEGE" 
Subject: Naive question about Gypsies [11255]



         My five-year old attended a puppet play on the weekend
         about a gypsy who steals children.  I am aware that
         Gypsies were stock villains or shady characters in the
         melodrama of our period, but is there any evidence that
         they kidnapped?

                                          Stephen D
                                          SDavies(at)mtroyal.ab.ca

===0===


Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 15:17:40 -0700 (MST)
From: "STEPHEN DAVIES, MT. ROYAL COLLEGE" 
Subject: Robert Chambers page [11256]



         I have to thank John Squires for sending me the hardcopy
         on which this week's etext is based, and also for putting
         me in touch with Henrick Johnsson who has created a
         Robert Chambers webpage at the address below:

    http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Corridor/5582/main.html

                                  Stephen D
                                  SDavies(at)mtroyal.ab.ca

===0===


Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 14:24:21 -0700
From: Jeff Sargent 
Subject: Re: Naive question about Gypsies [11255] [11257]



On Apr 16,  2:54pm, STEPHEN DAVIES, MT. ROYAL COLLEGE wrote:
> Subject: Naive question about Gypsies [11255] 
>        My five-year old attended a puppet play on the weekend
>        about a gypsy who steals children.  I am aware that
>        Gypsies were stock villains or shady characters in the
>        melodrama of our period, but is there any evidence that
>        they kidnapped?
>

I don't know about evidence, but it was a common view. "I was carried away by
Gypsies as a youth" used to be a stock humorous/colorful claim. Romantic, up
there with opium dens and white slavers as innocent views of the darker side of
life.

Must dash.
Sarge

-- 
    Comper Sarge   Jeffery L. N. Sargent
   Tippett Studios      2741 Tenth Street
     Berkeley, CA  94710 (510) 649-9711
     sarge(at)tippett.com    jefs(at)dnai.com
    -----------------------------------------
Boredom is a vital problem for the moralist, since 
at least half of the sins of mankind are caused by 
the fear of it.                 - Bertrand Russell

===0===


Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 17:30:33 -0500 (EST)
From: Robert Champ 
Subject: re: Naive question about Gypsies [11255] [11258]



I have never come across any evidence to show that the Gypsies
kidnapped anyone, though it may well exist.  It does remind me,
however, that during the Middle Ages especially, European Jews were 
accused of doing the same thing--and not only of kidnapping but also
murdering children in the service of obscene rites.  (Very reminiscent of 
what is going on today with stories of ritual Satanic abuse.) 

The Gypsies were/are very clannish and dealt with the cadjos (whites)
as little as possible.  No doubt they engaged in petty scams and
pilfering--but I would imagine that a crime as serious as kidnapping
would have been avoided, considering how much Gypsies were loathed to
begin with.

I often think that being kidnapped by Gypsies was a childhood fantasy,
something with which parents scared children and which children were
always intrigued by.

There is a writer in our period who wrote about the Gypsies, George Borrow,
whose work I've often wanted to delve into.  He wrote novels (_Lavengro_,
_Romany Rye_, _The Bible in Spain_) but I have no idea if he ever wrote
short stories on Gypsy themes.  Gypsy folklore is a very interesting topic,
and I hope one day we can investigate it.  

Bob Champ
rchamp(at)europa.umuc.edu

===0===


Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 15:42:04 -0600 (MDT)
From: "p.h.wood" 
Subject: Re: Naive question about Gypsies [11255] [11259]



On Wed, 16 Apr 1997, STEPHEN DAVIES, MT. ROYAL COLLEGE wrote:
>        My five-year old attended a puppet play on the weekend
>        about a gypsy who steals children.  I am aware that
>        Gypsies were stock villains or shady characters in the
>        melodrama of our period, but is there any evidence that
>        they kidnapped?
>                                         Stephen D
>                                         SDavies(at)mtroyal.ab.ca

This was an item of folklore in England in the 18th/19th centuries
according to my recollection. I have never seen any evidence; it cropped
up in the famous trial of Elizabeth Canning (the source for Josephine
Tey's "The Franchise Affair") and also in a folk-rhyme which goes:
         "My mother said I never should,
         Play with the gypsies in the wood.
         Down in the wood the grass was green.
         In came Sally with a tambourine.
         I came to a river with no bridge to get across,
         I paid five shillings for a blind white horse,
         I jumped upon its back and was off in a crack,
         Sally, tell my mother I am never coming back."

Like so many of these rhymes, it leaves me feeling vaguely uncomfortable,
with the sensation that there is more here than meets the eye. The
tambourine was a gypsy instrument, from their Levantine background
(originally the Rom came from the Indian sub-continent; there is a legend
about their origin in The Land of the Great Horses, which was taken away
from them, and turned them into wanderers. R. A. Lafferty used this as the
basis for a science-fantasy story called "The Land of the Great Horses" in
Harlan Ellison's anthology "Dangerous Visions" (1967)). The one-strand
river, bridgeless and uncrossable, is the river of death, from which
there is no returning. The blind white horse? The pale horse of Death
from the Book of the Revelation of St. John the Divine, commonly termed
"Revelations"? I have no idea.
Passed to others for comments.
Peter Wood

===0===


Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 16:48:05 -0500
From: ayc(at)ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (athan y chilton)
Subject: Re: Naive question about Gypsies [11255] [11260]



I have never read any evidence that Gypsies stole anybody's children.  When
questioned about this, in Jan Yoors' book, his Gypsy friends replied, "why
should we steal others' children?  We have plenty of our own!"

athan
ayc(at)ux1.cso.uiuc.edu


===0===


Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 18:25:04 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jo Churcher 
Subject: Re: Naive question about Gypsies [11255] [11261]



In _Five Children and It_, by E. Nesbit, the children, as a result of one
of their rash wishes which the Psammead grants, are apprehensive that the
Gipsies are going to kidnap the baby.  One of the women tells them that
there's no truth in that old story--that Gipsies usually have more than
enough children of their own, and wouldn't be likely to want to kidnap
anyone else's.
    Cheers!
    Jo


On Wed, 16 Apr 1997, STEPHEN DAVIES, MT. ROYAL COLLEGE wrote:

>        My five-year old attended a puppet play on the weekend
>        about a gypsy who steals children.  I am aware that
>        Gypsies were stock villains or shady characters in the
>        melodrama of our period, but is there any evidence that
>        they kidnapped?
> 
>                                         Stephen D
>                                         SDavies(at)mtroyal.ab.ca
> 

===0===


Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 15:50:37 -0700
From: Christopher Roden 
Subject: re: Naive question about Gypsies [11255] [11258] [11262]



Gaslighters might be interested to know, in relation to George Borrow, who
was one of Conan Doyle's favourite writers, that we shall shortly be
publishing an essay by Owen Dudley Edwards highlighting the influences of
Borrow - and *Lavengro* in particular - on the Sherlock Holmes stories.
There are fascinating associations and, as always with Edwards, it makes
fascinating reading.

The Essay will appear in *The Speckled Band*, the second of Calabash Press's
new series, *The Case Files of Sherlock Holmes*.

Christopher Roden


At 05:30 PM 4/16/97 -0500, you wrote:
>I have never come across any evidence to show that the Gypsies
>kidnapped anyone, though it may well exist.  It does remind me,
>however, that during the Middle Ages especially, European Jews were 
>accused of doing the same thing--and not only of kidnapping but also
>murdering children in the service of obscene rites.  (Very reminiscent of 
>what is going on today with stories of ritual Satanic abuse.) 
>
>The Gypsies were/are very clannish and dealt with the cadjos (whites)
>as little as possible.  No doubt they engaged in petty scams and
>pilfering--but I would imagine that a crime as serious as kidnapping
>would have been avoided, considering how much Gypsies were loathed to
>begin with.
>
>I often think that being kidnapped by Gypsies was a childhood fantasy,
>something with which parents scared children and which children were
>always intrigued by.
>
>There is a writer in our period who wrote about the Gypsies, George Borrow,
>whose work I've often wanted to delve into.  He wrote novels (_Lavengro_,
>_Romany Rye_, _The Bible in Spain_) but I have no idea if he ever wrote
>short stories on Gypsy themes.  Gypsy folklore is a very interesting topic,
>and I hope one day we can investigate it.  
>
>Bob Champ
>rchamp(at)europa.umuc.edu
>
>
*************************************************
*        Christopher Roden                        *
*        P.O. Box 1360                            *
*        Ashcroft                                 *
*        British Columbia                         *
*        Canada V0K 1A0                           *
*                                                 *
*        e-mail: ashtree(at)mail.netshop.net *
*************************************************

===0===


Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 16:58:26 -0700 (PDT)
From: Alan Gullette 
Subject: Sam Moskowitz, R.I.P. [11263]



Quoting from an email someone else forwarded:

     It is my sad duty to report that Sam Moskowitz died from complications 
     of a heart attack on Tuesday, April 15. Sam was an irreplaceable asset 
     in the fields of horror, fantasy and science fiction, in addition to 
     being one of the all around great guys, and he will be sorely missed.

Amen to that.

===0===


Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 20:23:44 -0400 (EDT)
From: Kujen(at)aol.com
Subject: from the Victorian list [11264]



Forwarded Message:

Date:    16, April 1997 8:55:38 AM
From:    GASKINS(at)WVNVM.WVNET.EDU (Avery F. Gaskins)
Subj:    Refrain Audacious Tar Your Suit From Pressing....
To:      VICTORIA(at)IUBVM.UCS.INDIANA.EDU

From:    GASKINS(at)WVNVM.WVNET.EDU (Avery F. Gaskins)
Sender:  VICTORIA(at)IUBVM.UCS.INDIANA.EDU (VICTORIA 19th-Century British
Culture
& Society)
Reply-to:        VICTORIA(at)IUBVM.UCS.INDIANA.EDU (VICTORIA 19th-Century British
Culture & Society)
To:      VICTORIA(at)IUBVM.UCS.INDIANA.EDU

Comments-on: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 08:28:25 -0400 (EDT)
Comments-of: "Avery F. Gaskins" 
    I thought this fit in with an earlier thread on uses of Victorian lit. in
the 20th Cen. Besides, it's entertaining. AFG
***----------------------> Original Mail From <----------------------***
     "P.W. Conner" 
***------------------------------------------------------------------***

Ya just gotta love this; it appeared on ANSAXNET, thus ending a silly
discussion on whether pre-Christian Anglo-Saxons were mysogynists or
not.

[This is dedicated to Hayden Ward...] 



"Heroine Barbarian" by Kevin Wald

>> [We join our operetta already in progress. The infamous Pirates of
Pergamum
>> have just seized a bevy of beautiful Mytilenean maidens, and are
attempting
>> to carry them off for matrimonial purposes. Gabrielle intervenes, with a
>> recitative (well, it's better than a pan flute solo):] 
>>
>> Gabrielle: Hold, scoundrels! Ere ye practice acts of villainy
>>               Upon the peaceful and agrarian,
>>            Just bear in mind, these maidens of My-TIL-ene[1] 
>>               Are guarded by a buff barbarian!
>>
>> Pirates: We'd better all rethink our cunning plan;
>>          They're guarded by a buff barbarian.
>>
>> Maidens: Yes, yes, she is a buff barbarian.
>>
>> [Xena leaps in from the wings, with a tremendous war cry, does a mid-air
>> somersault, and lands on her feet on the Pirate King's chest.] 
>>
>> Xena: Yes, yes, I am a buff barbarian! [The orchestra starts up.] 
>>
>>     I am the very model of a heroine barbarian;
>>     Through Herculean efforts, I've become humanitarian.
>>     I ride throughout the hinterland -- at least that's what they call it
in
>>     Those sissy towns like Athens (I, myself, am Amphipolitan).
>>     I travel with a poet who is perky and parthenian[2] 
>>     And scribbles her hexameters in Linear Mycenian[3] 
>>     (And many have attempted, by a host of methods mystical,
>>     To tell if our relationship's sororal or sapphistical).
>>
>> Chorus: To tell if their relationship's sororal or sapphistical!
>>         To tell if their relationship's sororal or sapphistical!
>>         To tell if their relationship's sororal or sapphisti-phistical!
>>
>> Xena: My armory is brazen, but my weapons are ironical;
>>     My sword is rather phallic, but my chakram's rather yonical[4] 
>>     (To find out what that means, you'll have to study Indo-Aryan[5]).
>>     I am the very model of a heroine barbarian!
>>
>> Chorus: To find out what that means, we'll have to study Indo-Aryan --
>>         She is the very model of a heroine barbarian!
>>
>> Xena: I wake up every morning, ere the dawn is rhododactylous[6] 
>>     (Who needs to wait for daylight? I just work by _sensus tactilis_[7].)
>>     And ride into the sunrise to protect some local villagers
>>     From mythologic monsters or from all-too-human pillagers.
>>     I hurtle towards each villain with a recklessness ebullient
>>     And cow him with my swordwork and my alalaes ululient[8];
>>     He's frightened for his head, because he knows I'm gonna whack it --
he's
>>     Aware that his opponent is the _Basileia Makhetes_!
>>
>> [The music crashes to a halt, as the Chorus stares at Xena in utter
>> confusion. She sighs.] It's *Greek*. It means "Warrior Princess"!
>> [Light dawns on the Chorus, and the music resumes.] Sheesh . . .
>>
>> Chorus: He knows that his opponent is the _Basileia Makhetes_!
>>         He knows that his opponent is the _Basileia Makhetes_!
>>         He knows that his opponent is the _Basileia Makhe-makhetes_,
>>
>> Xena: Because I've got my armor, which is really rather silly, on
>>     (It's cut so low I feel like I'm the topless tow'rs of Ilion,
>>     And isn't any use against attackers sagittarian[9]).
>>     I am the very model of a heroine barbarian!
>>
>> Chorus: It isn't any use against attackers sagittarian --
>>         She is the very model of a heroine barbarian!
>>
>> Xena: In short, when I can tell you how I break the laws of gravity,
>>     And why my togs expose my intermammary concavity,
>>     And why my comrade changed her dress from one that fit more comfily
>>     To one that shows her omphalos[10] (as cute as that of Omphale[11]),
>>     And why the tale of Spartacus appears in Homer's versicon[12],
>>     [She holds up a tomato:] 
>>     And where we found examples of the genus _Lycopersicon_[13],
>>     And why this Grecian scenery looks more like the Antipodes,
>>     You'll say I'm twice the heroine of any in Euripides!
>>
>> Chorus: We'll say she's twice the heroine of any in Euripides!
>>         We'll say she's twice the heroine of any in Euripides!
>>         We'll say she's twice the heroine of any in Euripi-ripides!
>>
>> Xena: But though the kinked chronology, confusing and chimerical
>>     (It's often unhistorical, but rarely unhysterical),
>>     Would give a massive heart attack to any antiquarian,
>>     I am the very model of a heroine barbarian!
>>
>> Chorus: 'Twould give a massive heart attack to any antiquarian --
>>         She is the very model of a heroine barbarian!
>>
>> [As the orchestra plays the final chords, a wild Xenaesque melee ensues,
>> and the curtain has to be brought down.] 
>>
>>
>> Notes:
>>
>> [1] Actually, "Mytilene" would properly be accented on the third syllable;
>>     Gabrielle always did have trouble with rhymes. (Mytilene,
incidentally,
>>     is a city on the isle of Lesbos -- the hometown of the poet Sappho, as
>>     a matter of fact. It is not clear what, if anything, Gilbert is trying
>>     to imply here.)
>>
>> [2] parthenian: virginal.
>>
>> [3] Linear Mycenian: Mycenian is the ancient dialect of Greek which was
>>     written in Linear B (a form of Greek writing that predates the
adoption
>>     of the alphabet). The implication is that Gabrielle does her writing
>>     in Linear B; if _Xena_ takes place around the time of the Trojan war,
>>     this is chronologically reasonable.
>>
>> [4] yonical: "Yonic" is the female counterpart to "phallic".
>>
>> [5] Indo-Aryan: The language group consisting of Sanskrit and its close
>>     relatives. Both "chakram" and "yonic" are of Sanskrit derivation.
>>
>> [6] rhododactylous: rosy-fingered. (Homer makes frequent reference to
>>     _rhododaktulos eos_ -- "rosy-fingered dawn".)
>>
>> [7] _sensus tactilis_: Latin for "the sense of touch".
>>
>> [8] "Alalaes" are war-cries (the Greeks spelled a Xena-like war cry as
>>     _alala_ or _alale_) and "ululient" is a coined term, apparently
>>     meaning "characterized by ululation".
>>
>> [9] sagittarian: archer-like.
>>
>> [10] omphalos: belly-button.
>>
>> [11] Omphale: Legendary queen of Lydia. From context, we must assume
>>     that she had a cute belly-button; however, no known classical source
>>     seems to address this vital issue.
>>
>> [12] versicon: a coined term, apparently meaning "collection of verse".
>>
>> [13] _Lycopersicon_: the biological genus to which tomatoes are assigned.
>>     (The tomato is a New World plant, and was entirely unknown in the
>>     Old World in pre-Columbian times. Thus, having tomatoes in a _Xena_ish
>>     context is an even greater anachronism than having Homer tell the tale
>>     of Spartacus.)


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Patrick W. Conner                    pconner(at)wvu.edu
Department of English
P.O.Box 6296                    office(304) 293-3107
West Virginia University          home(304) 292-2640
Morgantown, WV 26506               fax(304) 293-5380

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
***---------------------> End of Original Mail <---------------------***


----------------------- Headers --------------------------------
From owner-victoria(at)IUBVM.UCS.INDIANA.EDU  Wed Apr 16 08:43:45 1997


After all the trouble I caused Mario, Sherlene, and no doubt
others in hunting down the elusive Purple Emperor butterfly
on the Web, I almost hesitate to give a URL for the
Red Admiral, but in the hope that there are websters out
there who will, in case of similar trouble, point us 
to better routes (as Marsha and Jeff did for the PE), I offer the
following:

www.anglia.co.uk/angmulti/garden/admiral.html

The photo here shows the Red Admiral in flight. It isn't
quite as gorgeous as the Purple Emperor, but it is a very
fine, color creature.

I also discovered that there is a tune called "The Red
Admiral Butterfly" which appears as a cut on an album by
James Galway and the Chieftains.  Anyone heard it?

Bob Champ (who thinks he's seen that Xena parody before )
rchamp(at)europa.umuc.edu

===0===


Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 21:38:00 -0700
From: Sherlene 
Subject: Re: Red Admiral [11265] [11266]



Robert Champ wrote:
> 
> After all the trouble I caused Mario, Sherlene, and no doubt
> others in hunting down the elusive Purple Emperor butterfly
> on the Web, I almost hesitate to give a URL for the
> Red Admiral, but in the hope that there are websters out
> there who will, in case of similar trouble, point us
> to better routes (as Marsha and Jeff did for the PE), I offer the
> following:
> 
>  http://www.anglia.co.uk/angmulti/garden/admiral.html
> 
> The photo here shows the Red Admiral in flight. It isn't
> quite as gorgeous as the Purple Emperor, but it is a very
> fine, color creature.
> 
> I also discovered that there is a tune called "The Red
> Admiral Butterfly" which appears as a cut on an album by
> James Galway and the Chieftains.  Anyone heard it?
> 
> Bob Champ (who thinks he's seen that Xena parody before )
> rchamp(at)europa.umuc.edu


No trouble ol man, think nothing of it. Surfing is the name of the game!
The Chieftains, are they not an American Okie group?

Sherlene

===0===


Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 00:44:03 -0400 (EDT)
From: Debah(at)aol.com
Subject: Re: Chieftans and Gypsies [11267]



The Chieftans are an Irish group who are known for the traditional
instruments and tunes they play.  They began branching out a few years ago to
other tunes but they are best known for their beautiful Irish fiddle tunes
which I think best.

And just in case, since no one mentioned it "Gypsies" is a misnomer, it is
guessed from thinking that they came from Egypt rather than the Indian
sub-continent.  Doesn't the Romany language have something in common with
Urdu or Hindustani?

Deborah McMillion

===0===


Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 23:14:05 -1100
From: jamunro(at)terranet.ab.ca (alan munro)
Subject: Re: graverobber story [11234] [11268]



Indubitably, one of a number of works on the exploits of Burke and Hare who
started out as graverobbers supplying the anotomy department of (I believe)
the University of Edinburgh. Unfortunately, their capitalistic natures got
the better of them and they saw that prime prices were to be had for fresh
flesh and so took to speeding the passing of some unfortunates. They have
beenfictionalized and trivialized and even bowlderized in song and dance.
Still they show up well in black and white. 



>>       Was the story Stevenson's "The Body Snatchers," by any chance??
>>linda
>
>That sounds right, Linda.  Alas, I don't have a copy handy.  Additional info
>would be most helpful.  Cheers, Jack.
>
>
>
>Jack Kolb
>Dept. of English, UCLA
>kolb(at)ucla.edu
>
>
>
 J. Alan Munro
 jamunro(at)terranet.ab.ca
 Counsel for the Damned                   Time wounds all heels.
 Shilling taker and                       He who laughs, lasts.
 Convict baker.

===0===


Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 07:01:51 -0700 (MST)
Date-warning: Date header was inserted by MtRoyal.AB.CA
From: Moudry 
Subject: Re: Sam Moskowitz, R.I.P. [11263] [11269]



At 16:58 16/4/97 -0700, Alan Gullette wrote:
>Quoting from an email someone else forwarded:
>
>     It is my sad duty to report that Sam Moskowitz died from complications
>     of a heart attack on Tuesday, April 15. Sam was an irreplaceable asset
>     in the fields of horror, fantasy and science fiction, in addition to
>     being one of the all around great guys, and he will be sorely missed.
>
>Amen to that.
>
>
Really sad news. SaM (as his name was typed for decades) was one of the most
knowledgable researchers in the fields of science fiction, fantasy, and the
weird and a very rare person who had a compulsion to share his information
and stories with all of us. I trust that he made provisions for his
collections to be taken care of, without being brokwn up, so that future
generations may taste the essence of the fiction of the pulp era.

Goodbye, SaM.

Joe Moudry                        voice: (205) 934-3945
Development & Training            fax:    (205) 934-6530
The Univ. of Alabama (at) Birmingham         
Moudry(at)uab.edu

UAB's HRM Webmaster: www-hrm1.vpad/uab.edu
Saturn Web: www-hrm1.vpad.uab.edu/saturn

Producer/host: Classic Jazz, Big Band Jazz,  & New Jazz 
on WUAL (91.5 FM, Tuscaloosa/Birmingham),
WQPR (88.7 FM, Muscle Shoals/NW Alabama), &
WAPR (88.3 FM, Selma/Central Alabama)
/|/

===0===


Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 08:42:29 -0500
From: ayc(at)ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (athan y chilton)
Subject: re: Naive question about Gypsies [11255] [11258] [11270]



 during the Middle Ages especially, European Jews were
>accused of doing the same thing--and not only of kidnapping but also
>murdering children in the service of obscene rites.

Um, yes.  They were accused of cannibalism, in fact.  Eating the little
ones at Passover, or some such.

>I often think that being kidnapped by Gypsies was a childhood fantasy,
>something with which parents scared children and which children were
>always intrigued by.

This is probably quite so, although it also makes me wonder where kids pick
up the idea.  The puppet show mentioned in the original post is a good
example, I imagine.  I am wondering where *I* picked it up, though, because
I have no recollection of ever hearing about Gypsies as a small child--yet
I once accused *my* mother of stealing *me* FROM the gypsies!! A different
twist on the notion, to be sure.

>Gypsy folklore is a very interesting topic,and I hope one day we can
>investigate it.

May I second this motion?  It's one of my major fascinations.
>
Athan
ayc(at)ux1.cso.uiuc.edu


===0===


Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 09:37:56 +0000
From: azalcman(at)randomhouse.com
Subject: re: Naive question about Gypsies [11255] [11258] [11271]



A little off the path of child snatching (pretty much a myth) but for those who 
would like to learn more about Gypsies, a  wonderful book came out about a year 
ago called BURY ME STANDING, about life among modern Gypsies.  It also 
discusses the Gypsies' history as well as their relationships with other 
peoples.  The author (I'm sorry, I've forgotten her name) lived with a group of 
Gypsies and some of her insights such as why (and how) they would keep a horse 
in an apartment building were fascinating.  

Amelia Zalcman
AZalcman(at)randomhouse.com

))))))))) Previous Notes Mail 
((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((
To: GASLIGHT (at) mtroyal.ab.ca (at) SMTP
cc:  (bcc: Amelia Zalcman/Ballantine/RandomHouse)
From: rchamp (at) europa.umuc.edu (Robert Champ) (at) SMTP 
Date: 04/16/97 05:30 PM  
Subject: re: Naive question about Gypsies [11255] [11258] 

I have never come across any evidence to show that the Gypsies
kidnapped anyone, though it may well exist.  It does remind me,
however, that during the Middle Ages especially, European Jews were 
accused of doing the same thing--and not only of kidnapping but also
murdering children in the service of obscene rites.  (Very reminiscent of 
what is going on today with stories of ritual Satanic abuse.) 

The Gypsies were/are very clannish and dealt with the cadjos (whites)
as little as possible.  No doubt they engaged in petty scams and
pilfering--but I would imagine that a crime as serious as kidnapping
would have been avoided, considering how much Gypsies were loathed to
begin with.

I often think that being kidnapped by Gypsies was a childhood fantasy,
something with which parents scared children and which children were
always intrigued by.

There is a writer in our period who wrote about the Gypsies, George Borrow,
whose work I've often wanted to delve into.  He wrote novels (_Lavengro_,
_Romany Rye_, _The Bible in Spain_) but I have no idea if he ever wrote
short stories on Gypsy themes.  Gypsy folklore is a very interesting topic,
and I hope one day we can investigate it.  

Bob Champ
rchamp(at)europa.umuc.edu


 

===0===


Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 09:13:29 -0500
From: ayc(at)ux1.cso.uiuc.edu (athan y chilton)
Subject: re: Naive question about Gypsies [11272]



 BURY ME STANDING

Isabel Fonseca is the author.

One of the more fascinating and revealing incidents she describes is that
despite the apparent slovenliness of the 'settled' Rom's living conditions,
Isabel was not permitted to bathe herself.  Two young 'bori'
(daughters-in-law) were detailed to perform this duty, in order that the
'gajo' woman would not be unclean by Rom standards.  This relates to their
concept of 'marhime' which might be seen as both a woman's power and as a
negative view of her physicality.  There is a considerable discussion of
this belief in Jan Yoors' book 'The Gypsies' as well.

The contrast between these two books is quite enlightening, as Yoors' book
was written mostly before WWII, when many European Rom were still nomadic,
while Fonseca's is current.

Athan
ayc(at)ux1.cso.uiuc.edu


===0===


Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 13:28:49 -0400
From: "John D. Squires" 
Subject: Sam Moskowitz, R. I. P. [11273]



                        4/17/97
Gaslighters,

        I was saddened to learn from Alan 's e-mail this morning of SaM's
passing.  We had corresponded off & on since 1979, sometimes bickering over
our divergent readings of Shiel, but more often with friendly exchanges.  I
will miss the books he didn't finish, but appreciate the ones he already
gave us all the more.  A further copy of my nomination to the 1996 Gaslight
Hall of Fame should go out with this.  I  regret I didn't send Sam a copy.
        John Squires
        Shiel_Search(at)compuserve.com  

===0===


Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 13:28:49 -0400
From: "John D. Squires" 
Subject: Sam Moskowitz, R. I. P. [11274]



To:   "INTERNET:gaslight(at)MtRoyal.AB.CA", INTERNET:gaslight(at)MtRoyal.AB.CA
From: INTERNET:gaslight(at)MtRoyal.AB.CA, INTERNET:gaslight(at)MtRoyal.AB.CA
Date: 1/23/97,  4:33 PM
Re:   Re: Call for nominations to Gaslight 1996 Hall of Fame [10531] [10533] [10536] [10558] 
 
 
Sender: gaslight-error(at)MtRoyal.AB.CA

Received: by dub-img-1.compuserve.com (8.6.10/5.950515) id LAA16283; Thu,
 23 Jan 1997 11:49:09 -0500
Date: Thu, 23 Jan 1997 07:51:56 -0500
From: "John D. Squires" <105326.3351(at)compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: Call for nominations to Gaslight 1996 Hall of Fame [10531] [10533] 
 [10536] [10558] 

Comments: Gaslight Literary Discussion List
 
Dear Gaslighters,
 
     Ignoring for the moment my primary obsessions with M. P. Shiel, I would recommend
the following authors for the 1996 Hall of Fame:
 
     William Hope Hodgson (1877-1918)
     Arthur Machen (1863-1947), and
     E. F. Benson (1867-1940).
 
     For Editor/Critic, I would recommend Sam Moskowitz. Among many others, he  edited 
Science Fiction by Gaslight: A History and Anthology of Science Fiction in the Popular
Magazines, 1891-1911, World, (1968); Under the Moons of Mars: A History and Anthology of
"The Scientific Romance" in the Munsey Magazines, 1912-1920, World, (1970); and The
Crystal Man: Stories by Edward Page Mitchell, Doubleday, (1973). 
     His books touching on gaslight authors include Science Fiction in Old San Francisco:
The History of the Movement from 1854 to 1890, Donald Grant, (1980) (with a companion
anthology of fiction), and Explorers of the Infinite: Shapers of Science Fiction, World, (1963). 
Other important collections include three volumes of William Hope Hodgson's stories, all
published by Donald M. Grant with substantial introductory essays on Hodgson by Moskowitz,
Out of the Storm (1975), The Haunted Pampero (1991, reprinted 1996), and Terrors of the Sea
(1996).
     While I have not agreed with certain of his opinions, everyone interested in gaslight
authors owes Mr. Moskowitz an incalculable debt for the many treasures he has managed to
salvage from rare, musty and almost forgotten periodicals of the era.  I can think of no other
living editor more deserving of this group's commendation.
 
     John Squires
     Shiel_Search(at)compuserve.com 

===0===


Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 17:33:24 -0600 (CST)
From: "Ruth W. Jeffries" 
Subject: Re: Naive question about Gypsies [11255] [11260] [11275]



>I have never read any evidence that Gypsies stole anybody's children.  When
>questioned about this, in Jan Yoors' book, his Gypsy friends replied, "why
>should we steal others' children?  We have plenty of our own!"

Part (only one of many) of the implication at the time was that gypsies 
literally "kidnapped"--holding the children of wealthy parents for 
ransom money.  Whether there are any documented cases of this actually 
having happened I haven't heard.

The folk-rhyme Peter Wood quoted associates the gypsy stories with those of 
the fairies, who stole away children who were never seen again.

There are several encounters with gypsies in nineteenth-century novels, but 
the only one I can think of in a short story (which doesn't turn out to be 
a gypsy, anyway, if memory serves aright) is in Mrs. Henry Wood's first 
(and second, follow-up) story in the first volume of the _Johnny Ludlow_ 
series.  Why don't we all keep our eyes out for gypsy short stories?

Ruth Jeffries
University of Minnesota
jeff0002(at)gold.tc.umn.edu

End of Gaslight digest.